Ep 519-Lets Talk About It: The Bourbon That Makes Men Talk

A bottle of bourbon doesn’t usually lead to a conversation about the father wound, therapy, and the fear that drives high-performing men, but that’s exactly where Aaron Amsler and I go. Double A Bourbon is the doorway, not the destination. The real story is what happens when a man stops performing long enough to ask a hard question: who am I when no one is watching, and what am I leaving in my wake?

Aaron shares the origin of the 4-6 “affirmation and accountability” mindset, why he ties it to 100 proof ownership, and how COVID forced him to sit still and audit his bandwidth. We talk about men’s mental health in plain language: the shame around asking for help, the tunnel vision that looks like ambition, and the gap between how we see ourselves and how the people who love us see us. If you’ve ever thought, “I’ll figure it out alone,” you’ll recognize what that costs in relationships, leadership, and peace.

We also get into why encouragement feels awkward for many men, how brotherhood and community can make honesty possible, and how the AA Legion is built to pull guys into the arena together. Then we zoom out to the mission growing across states, including a Seattle Mariners partnership, while keeping the focus where it belongs: becoming more present, more grounded, and more real.

If this hits home, subscribe, share it with a friend who needs to be seen, and leave a review so more people can find these conversations. What’s one thing you’re ready to stop carrying alone?

Transcript

Accountability Starts With Self-Reflection

SPEAKER_02 0:45

But if you were ever held accountable, you can only allocate focus with yourself having got things if you ever spent time just recognizing what the effects of your behaviors were on other people. That's a shallow person. But then you think about what if your parents are just so wrapped up they don't have enough availability or time to be able to invest. Raising a kid to create standards and boundaries and virtues in them. How far do I go beyond myself? I did not know that about myself because I have not thought about that. Why not? Well, I haven't had anything just disturbed by reality enough to make me do it. People just get in the comfort zone.

SPEAKER_03 1:13

Wow. One word. Profound.

A Bourbon With A Deeper Message

SPEAKER_03 1:17

Now, we have discussed bourbon before on this podcast a long time ago. And one of our sponsors, uh Northwest Hills Liquor, has a lot of bourbon. But the meaning of this episode goes much deeper than that gentleman's bourbon. The connection I have to him dates way back to when I had a full head of hair, and I have no idea why there are fireworks behind me right now. Maybe that's some foresight to what may change your life, create fireworks in your life when you hear the message behind this bourbon and a program of people who have joined this gentleman called the AA Legion. A bourbon with a message and quite a story. Let's talk about it.

From 1998 To Now

SPEAKER_03 2:26

Aaron Amsler. How you doing, Sean Class? Man, it's this has been you and I have talked about this for at least two years. And I joke about it because we're on episode 519, and I say we've done about 20 of the 5 now 19 episodes, which were non-sports related. They were more about overcoming adversity, people failing, and learning more about failure, but real deep stories, even about businesses, entrepreneurs. But this is all of that. Um, before we get going, uh, I am Sean Clinch, if you were not aware. I am the host of Stories Inside the Man Cape Podcast. And I definitely, as I mentioned, follow us on each of our social media platforms. They're all right there, and you can subscribe for free to our YouTube page. And we love all of our sponsors, and we're gonna periodically drop a few of those throughout this episode. But I want Aaron Amsler to tell everybody, tell you, the audience who are listening, whether they're driving or watching on one of those platforms, YouTube, Facebook, or the the X platform that I still call Twitter. Aaron, take us back to uh I say 1997, I think it was, or 98.

SPEAKER_02 3:50

I was I was thinking about it earlier, and then you think about you know, 1998, that doesn't seem too far away. So you do the math on it, like, man, my 1998 is what I used to hear somebody say 1978. I think that was a long time ago, right? It's not, you know, it's um it's it's the irony of the moment of where we're in right now. And for me, I'm I'm not shocked whatsoever, right? And to go all the way back to '98 when you and I met working at a liquor store in Academic, Texas. I didn't know you from Adam. Um, and you know, we became friends. I was going through that rush process and everything else, and we got to hang out. Of course, you went your own way with this with it with your fraternity guys and me as well. And and then, of course, the circle back in Liberty Hill in 2015 or 2016, and uh, I see Sean Clinch coming down the sideline, and I'm just yelling, I'm like, Clinch, and you turn around, it's like we saw each other yesterday. And and that's the thing I've learned, you know, through the so much of being able to look back in time. And if you take the opportunity to put this in your framework to see that everything, everything in the rearview was always supposed to be, and more importantly, all the people, right, that were a part of your past. And I've learned that you know your people, right? You know your people because you got no problem being honest with them, and you can, you know, you don't have to worry about showing them anything other than who you are, and so that's why you and I have always had a connection, and lo and behold, what is it, April 22nd, 2026? Sean Clinch has gone from being on the sidelines, newscaster, right? Diving off into uh pharmaceuticals, and then you made it back to where you are now, which is you're telling people stories.

SPEAKER_03 5:33

That's a good point, man. It's uh life is funny, and sometimes it takes different paths to reach where you belong. And I think through our conversation, without spoiling what we're gonna talk about, is just two good friends, two men having conversation. That's what we're going to establish this as. And what you and I have talked about as um uh I don't know why I'm hiding behind the screen, but I think all of us can relate that I've learned more through failures. I have thought I had to go down this path and I forced a path, and it led me to a failure that maybe I didn't learn anything from. But other failures I've learned from 90% of them at least. Um, before we get going, I gotta pay homage to our guy Dave Ramirez, who you know pretty well, um, at Northwest Hills Liquor. Yeah, we're your uh guests, not a customer. Dave, as you know, he's as about as genuine as they come.

SPEAKER_02 6:50

You know, I ran into him at cover three uh the other day. We were catching up, and uh, you know, I th I think he's he's got the bourbons either there or in route, uh, but had the opportunity uh to visit with him more than once about the brand. The first time was with you. Yeah, and man, you look up and it's it's three months, four months have gone by. It's today is no different than yesterday. It was just a day for me, and I'm just trying to experience time and what we need to do here. And I look up and haven't talked to you guys in months, and and I called him, I said, hey man, let's hook up. And so that's the way this has been going for me, and you're spot on with him. You know, you're spot on. You can tell that it's it, you know, not only just to have that store, the passion he has, right? And for him to be the GM at cover three as long as he was, and you can't be that person if you're not attuned to people's needs. And for him to take what he's doing with his liquor store and really, you know, to create that Cheers bar mentality, uh, for lack of a better term, that's a what's the point of difference is when people walk in, right? You know them. And that's where people want to go because they want to be seen. And and that's anywhere

Men Are Starving To Be Seen

SPEAKER_02 7:52

in life. People are starving to be seen. And that that was the biggest driver for putting this bourbon together, you know, after traveling 125, 150 days a year for God, well over a decade, and before that, just as much as during COVID, when everything slowed down, a lot of people had an opportunity, I think, to think. And boy, I certainly did a lot of reflection, and I was you know, pretty resentful at that time, you know, feeling like you know, I want to be seen for who I am. Look what I've done. And holy moly, man, getting on the road here of uh when you when you really, as a man to ultimately find out accountability is to know that it's my peace, right? And if I can't hang on to it, what's that say about me? And so, you know, I really I feel like I just threw myself up on the table and got out the microscope and and started going through and breaking up rocks and seeing what was gold and and what wasn't, right? What was cold, what I needed to get rid of, what was never mine, and what I collected along the way in in life. And that's that's been the journey for me is is certainly to understand that um men are starving to be seen, and what we don't understand is the things that we carry that were never ours, that were just passed to us, that affect the way we show up in life. And what I mean by that is well, what's my face look like when I'm just resting, right? How do I look when I come in? I'm on the hamster wheel and I'm still thinking about work, right? Go to the airport and and and wait, watch planes boarding, and everybody's got their face in their phone, right? And so uh I had to understand how I contributed to that too, and why that was, and there was always something for me to be doing, uh, and I it kept my mind from being in the moment. So I'm right here with you, brother. Let's talk.

SPEAKER_03 9:32

Let's talk, man. We got a lot to talk about. And and seriously, I I would be doing an injustice. Um, so our friends Doug and Katie Young, uh, they've expanded from cover three to whiskey ridge. And when you got this going, those are two of the I I love those two, and they're just good people. You had a presentation of double A. Let me tell you what Aaron did. Not only did he have bottles to give people, he he wrote a message on every one to give to the people who are in attendance. I'm not opening this ever. I'm gonna buy another bottle, of course, but I mean, we'll get into all this what all this represents because there I'm not lying or exaggerating when I say this has a much deeper meaning. I want to read to you what he wrote on here. Clinch. Maybe one of the most kindest and sincere men I have ever known. And this dates back to our time at the old liquor mart. Nackerdoch's taxes, because I had to pay for my way through college. Sometimes I work three jobs. And yeah, you too. And nothing, I don't think anything stopped. I think I'm still doing that right now, but because I love it. Um having seen this, and I'm so proud of you, because if we're gonna be honest and be legit, it takes balls to admit hey, something needs to change with me. I need to learn from that reflection in the mirror. But when you see a friend or family member that has achieved something like this, look at this. There's a lot of meaning to that picture. Okay? I know this is just old. I'm gonna let you take off at this because the genesis of this bourbon, how did this all start?

The Origin Story Behind 4-6

SPEAKER_03 11:36

And I know you were in the business and and and in the liquor business and and a certain wine, but when did you think, okay, how did this all come together on paper? Or was it uh one of those nights or at a special place when okay, this is what I'm going to do.

SPEAKER_02 11:56

Yeah, it's amazing when you get to that threshold in time. And uh, you know, the medallion that's on the band uh represents the time in 2010. I was working for a publicly traded company and and uh was being summoned out to California to quote unquote interview for my job. I mean, let's just be honest, we were about to go through the sausage maker, find out who you were. And so in 2020, you know, after I just got in from a trip from Guatemala we had done every year, and then you know the world started to shut down. Right, you started to see a lot of creativity throughout the world at that point in time, but I was really seeing the world right and and and and being uh very fearful and how it was reacting to it. And you know, I mean, I really had a lot of honest conversations with myself my entire life. I knew what my fears were, and um, but I really didn't know how they could uh control me, right? So they could take me away from the moment, uh, they can take me away from actually experiencing time right here because I was too busy trying to prevent an outcome, create an outcome, or making sure that um maybe I was sitting back procrastinating because I had still yet to learn, hey, there's a different turn. I don't have to be Chevy Chase on this freaking roundabout in Europe. You know, at some point in time, I gotta look and see you're right, if I can pull my blind spots away that are keeping me so hyper-focused on this path. That is that really my path? Hell, I don't know, but that's what I was taught, right? All these things that I was taught, and that it really started to crumble for me. And when I looked back at that time, and that's how I presented myself as a brand, we don't have enough time to go through that today. Um, but that was the most fearful time in my life in 2010. I think I was early 30s. I had you know three kiddos. Uh, one was you know a couple years old at the time, uh, was my youngest. And I was like, man, that was the most fearful time in my life. But I looked back at it and said, man, that was the most empowering day of my life. Because if you back me against the wall, I'm gonna show you who I am. And I immediately went to the men in my life that had helped build me. And so I talk about the foundation there and uh the live oak limb and the steel pipe and the feather and the flame and to build that and create that in front of those folks that were effectively, I was on trial, right? I was there to sell myself and prove myself. And you know, that exercise went great. And and when I did present, you know, myself as a brand, and I was just like, you know what? You want to know who I am, I'm gonna show you. Best moment my life. And and so that was a reminder for me in 2020. I look back at 2010 and I'm like, man, I built myself and I said who I was, but I don't think I've made any any progress on that. If anything, I feel like I got even further to go, right? The older we get, the more we know, the more we see about ourselves. But I always felt like I was chasing a rabbit, I was never gonna catch. Uh, no achievements were ever enough. And but those are the things I was built to do and to become. And uh, but at some point in time, the tool bag's got to switch out. You've got to switch the tool bag out uh because uh you have to become a more complex human being. When we grow up, it's just us, right? And then you get married, right? And now you've got to kind of split yourself, and then you've got kids, you've got all these activities, and all of a sudden, next thing you know, you're just spread thin. And a lot of us men were just grew up with a belief system that we had to perform.

Affirmation And Accountability Defined

SPEAKER_02 15:20

And man, I got to tell you, that is um, I get it, I understand it, I know it, but when that four six, the OG, affirmation and accountability, that was a moment for me to realize so many things and and how much my perspective has evolved even now to today. Um, but affirmation and accountability, that's affirmation of the distinct value and purpose of a man. We're irreplaceable, that's not up for debate. But duty of service to others is his foremost accountability while continuously seeking the best version of himself. And I know man to man to me, and the conversations always had within me, the effort I was given was enough. What were the results? And so that's what I was really thinking about that time frame, and it's a hundred-proof, and there's so many reasons that that came together. But with the affirmation and accountability being a hundred-proof, it's every man's a sum of one, and every every number one is broken out in a hundred percent. And so, really thinking about breaking that out to a pie chart, and where was my bandwidth, my bandwidth being allocated, and how many of that's how much that stuff didn't serve meeting, right? How much did I don't need this for football practice? I don't need this, I don't need this to whatever. And it really for me was a moment to understand and know that I had flown past every goal I ever had financially, and so really the vision that came in my eyes was like that space shuttle. When they get up in the air, they would drop those boosters. They're still going the same speed. And at that point in time, you got to let go of everything that drove you. That way you can actually enjoy it and be around and be available and be present. And if you can't be available, you can't be present and you can't lead. And so, when you talk about what is a man, you know, our ultimate accountability is to serve others, uh, and our ultimate accountability is to serve ourselves. And um, and so who is that and what is that? And and for me, I I you know, I just had to learn that you know, growing up as a boy with when without a dad in the house, and coaches were my mentors, uh, and they really taught me how to be a dad, you know, and my mentors and my coaches, and that's good and bad. Um, but you know, what was it about me that wasn't working out? And I it was I still serving things inside of me that I was still trying to disprove. And who's whose voice was that? And it was that necessary to drive me to where I get to create the standard of excellence. I thought I had, right? Nobody's perfect, we're always looking for it. And but that was just a moment for me, and then I remember that just being a gift. And I was thinking, you know, to see the world for what it was and to see me. And I was like, you know, what are the things about me that you can't get me out of character? And I wrote down I would eat last, I would starve first, I would give up my safety or my life for my family. And at the end of the day, I'm at least the majority shareholder in the success or the demise of all of it. And right under that, I wrote, no victim. So I'm like, well, if it's not out there, it's gotta be here. And I tell you, this has been the most amazing thing for me uh to go through and really to write a story back to myself and really to understand just to have just this profound faith uh that we're all here to do something, to create, and to give. Um, my way wasn't working. I thought it was. I had life white knuckled. Are you kidding me? I mean, I had everything under control, and what I had to finally realize is I had to let go of everything else, right? And and I had to understand why I was trying to do for so many things and to create outcomes. And I learned that I'll just try to protect everybody from the pain that was still inside me. And man, you talk about humility, and then how did I show up in that mindset? And you know, it's that's why I talk about the skins of humility that I find within myself is self-awareness, awareness of myself. Well, who the hell am I? Well, I had that conversation with myself. Who am I? What do I believe? And am I honoring myself, you know, and am I truly honoring myself or am I selling myself out to make the world appeased? Am I am I trying to keep those happy? Am I playing to the audience? And uh man, I gotta tell you, the most liberating thing for me ever was to realize and understand that uh that conversation needed to be between myself and the voice inside me uh that took me down the path to understand it, to really dive into this work as to why I was, why I am, but who the hell am I? I know who I am, I've always heard that, and now I listen to that, right? I don't listen to the I don't listen to the audience, man. I just listen to me because every time I do, uh, and the level of patience and unfolding, and the people that have come here to be a part of this with me, and for that four six, I don't know if you've got the visual, but there's a handout. The storm has come through, and there's a hand, hold the bottle of the four six, and this is a gift to men. It's like, here you go, brother. Guess what? It's just what you wanted. You want to know how to get there, you got to be accountable 1000%. And if oh man, hey, bro, this is yours, and here's the path, right? Okay, I'll take that because nothing else has worked. Temporary fixes, right? We get how many times you ever got a new pay raise, or if I can just get this, that it's never enough. That was never the issue. The issue is you always try to prove it to yourself, and the truth is you always were. And so when I tell you, when I say, I see you, Sean Clinch, I've seen you forever. And you know what you have not done? Changed one damn bit. You have always been the same man. And I see you out here in everything that you're doing, trying to make a difference in people's lives. You're trying to make sure everybody's accommodated, you're trying to make sure you got the best material, you're trying to be the best proposition. You wanna know why? Because that's who you are, and that's who you believe you're supposed to be. So I see you, bro. Always have. Man.

SPEAKER_03 21:04

I didn't know we were gonna have a moment. I just let's don't be in control, bro. Let's just go right here. My thing is, you said at least three dozen things. And if you're watching this episode, listen, it's different when you're when we're having conversations and planning these episodes. His mission behind this, the story behind it, I'm not I'm not gonna lie to you.

The Father Wound And Standards

SPEAKER_03 21:30

I said this to you on the phone in person, whatever. I our lives are similar, but different. Meaning, early in my life, I was always told what I couldn't do. And then I lose my father a week before I turned 13. You know, it's it's and it's nothing young ladies need their daddies. Young ladies obviously need their mothers, but when you lose Your father to it. And that was a loving man. He was an alcoholic. But he was a, if there's a such thing, a jovial, good alcoholic, if there is a such. And I'm not good man. Strong. Pushed me, a military guy. I mean, pushed me hard. But when you lose that guy, a chunk of your foundation is gone. And you said about your coaches and these father figures and these other strong men in your life. My mom, who was the best soul ever, she knew, and you and I talked about, she knew she couldn't be the dad. She did her best. Didn't know how. Didn't know how. But she was the strongest mother. She reached to Kate, but she reached, she gave her me her best always until I left to go where you and I would meet. That was the worst day of her life when I left. But anyway, why this? I want to stay on topic. Coaches poured into me, pushed me, held me accountable. But I didn't believe in myself fully until that senior year, and then when I left Austin for 20 years. And when I met you, it was when my confidence was sky high. I knew who I was. I was no, I could have moved anywhere in the country. I was ready to. And this is amazing when you think about this. When you buy a bottle of this, even if you just want it to put in your display, it represents something greater. It's not just glass and bourbon. There's a mission behind it. And there's even something behind this that I want I can't explain it. Aaron will have to. The double A Legion. There's a following, but it's not just a following, it's a program, right?

SPEAKER_02 24:17

You know, at this point, man, we with so much going on, and I know that we were going to do this. And if if I could tell you everything is unfolding the way it should, you know. Um, there was I wrote down so much stuff, and I had to go all the way back to Coach Steve Gaddis getting in my damn backpack when I was a senior in high school, you know, in metal shop, but Coach Gaddis didn't have any boundaries when it came. No football coaches do when they come in, you know, they just do what they want. And I had no idea, but I had written a poem um in my bed. That you know, that was the first year ever at Spring Hill High School that that we had a group together that was doing special things. And I wrote Brotherly Love, right? And so it was a poem to I hell, I never knew I was a poem, but that's always been some way of expressing, right? That's how I felt, and I wrote it to my teammates, right? And so to be a part of something like that, and then the other night to catch up with all those Liberty Hill dads from that that that 2020 football team, was it 2020 or 2021 football team that amazing you talk about a heartbreaker in the semis, but the the story and everything behind that, but to get together and be with them, and it just reminded me of a time back during COVID that you know everything shut down, and you know, Sean Lapazinski, one of the dads there in Liberty Hill, that's always been a part of the youth football program, and he put together this event. It was called Warriors Forge, and it was going to be dads showing up and we were working our kids out during the offseason because everything was shut down. And and so we did. There was like 25 dads. And so when I go back and I think about these things, I wrote down where we are in this world, I was like, if not us, then who, right? If not us, then who will tackle this men, right? We know that is our responsibility. And I go back to that time and think about at Warriors Forge and all those dads that showed up, they showed up with love for their boys because they didn't want them, they didn't want them to be behind, right? And if there was any way that we could, you know, we were out there, you know, for almost, I guess maybe a couple of months working those boys out so they didn't get left behind, or maybe that they could have a step ahead. And uh, but I think about that, it's like, man, men show up. Men show up in crisis, right? Men show up and don't ask for anything. And and that's the thing about it though, too, is it's okay for me. I should be able to tell Sean Clinch the way I see him, and he should be able to say, Thank you, brother. Thank you for seeing me. You know what I mean? And that's the gap. And um, but we always continuously try and do enough for the world to tell us it's enough. And I see the world right now, I see men. I'm like, you are, baby. Let's go. And just let go of all your fears and create and become and show, you know, um, exactly maybe what your expression of being a man, of being a leader is, and in whatever did you choose to chasten your passion and clinch, and even what you're doing. Uh, how you know what how does Sean Clinch put this thing together and express it in a way that is just truly to his authenticity, and we don't worry about the audience. And right now I care less about the audience. I'm here with my buddy Sean Clinch, and um, so it's just it's it's been such an amazing reflection to go back and look at the bottle for me to tell you, hell, that's all I've always seen you that way, man. You know what I didn't realize? I didn't realize that I had a huge gap in how I saw myself versus other people saw me. Uh you always know your people, right? Right, and uh, but also it's it's just a gift, and I really just live by this principle moving forward. And it's taken me a long time to get here. It is only the things outside of me that remind me what's left inside that I need to go settle up with. And most of it's bullshit, it's pain that was never yours, right? It's people pass pain because they don't know what it means, and so we're seeing so many men, so proud of men, leveling up in all these programs to really say, you know what? All right, I'm putting down the gloves because I've done it my way, you know, and and but I finally finally got to a point in my life where I genuinely asked for help, and uh it'll come a running if you allow it.

Why Asking For Help Feels Hard

SPEAKER_03 28:25

To this day, I'm gonna put it out there. I have problems. I struggle to ask for help. I can't, I I it is one of the hardest things this has been in my whole life. I'm not saying I'm a lone wolf walking around, but I I have always been one. My God, I'm gonna I'm gonna find the solution. I'm gonna figure it out on my own. Whether it be, hey, I'm gonna I may fail doing this, but I'm gonna figure it out. I'm gonna get my ass back up and I'm gonna figure it out. But the problem there is, isn't that how you've always played the game of life?

SPEAKER_02 29:13

Isn't that how you play to get better? You have to fail, right? Asking for help. I'm with you. And it's why is that why do you think that is? Why do you think why do you think that is? You know, a lot of us guys that grew up without a dad in home, we had a mom doing the best she could, but there are a lot of things that we needed to learn. You know, my parents separated when I was seven and divorced at eight. And so what did I miss out on, right? And and so you think about those times as a boy, and whether you're going through youth sports or going about the game of life or whatever, the the worst thing you ever want to do is just get shamed by somebody getting on you for doing something wrong. So you come hyper-vigilant, man. It's like I ain't gonna allow that to happen again, ever again, right? But you learn to buy into that and the value that I can do this, right? But I have to do this, right? I have to be in this mindset. But at some point in time, man, that toolback, like I said, it don't serve you. It might serve you, but it don't serve what you're here for. Um, and does that make sense? And so we we struggle to ask for help because we're ashamed to ask for help. And and when we ask for help, sometimes maybe someone was having a bad day or whatever the heck it was, and then they made you feel bad about asking it, but it didn't have anything to do with them, but it was impactful on you, and so you learn not to ask for help, and then you taught yourself, you know what, if I just go full speed, in everything I do, I'm gonna figure this out. And so back to you about not asking for help based on what I just said. Let me hear the rest of what you got to say.

SPEAKER_03 30:50

Man, it's thinking about all this, I think it's far greater. There's let's picture an umbrella the inability to ask for help. Now, don't get me wrong, I've asked for something digital with pertaining to my job or whatnot. I'm gonna ask somebody an IT. Hey, I'm gonna shoot you a quick text email to give me a shortcut. Because I I've I've wasted 15 minutes trying to figure this out. I'm gonna do that. But if it's hands-on on learning how to navigate somewhere, not somewhere driving, but to get to that point to where I want to be, to a relationship, or building something like that requires my hands, or achieving a goal, or or something is something I did a few years ago, jumping out of a plane with a parachute. I haven't done that. I would do it every week if I could. It's the most exhilarating thrill, sense of peace I've ever felt in my life. Um everything negative, that and rappelling down a building in downtown Austin, that was the fear that I had. I was clenched up, let it go. But to get myself there, admitting that I need help, has been a struggle of mine my whole life. And I honestly feel like it has poured into my personal relationship sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 32:30

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely, absolutely. How how you think you're showing up to perform in that relationship, just like you've done in everything else in your life, right? You're just you're doing it the way the best that you can do it, and you you're learning to please, and you know, that's not the way to it. And I tell you, this is think of it this way, Clinch. We talk about asking for help, and I I think about I always go back to the diving board, and I'm not certain on this fact, so don't nail me here. But I'm pretty certain every kid that's jumped off of a diving board, I've never heard of one drown. But if you think about that time in life, and I mean you've pictured it, you were there, but think about afterwards and the encouragement that has to come from that, right? To get someone to jump off a diving board. And when the kids come up with a smiling, they have just eradicated every bit of fear that their mind has told them that they are to be fearful of. And so you think about what it took up to get up there, right? There's a lot of things, but encouragement, and that's the one thing we walk away from as men because we carry it all in our head, and so you talk about the double-A Legion, what this is about. Step in the arena with me and tell me you can't. Let's go. I'll show you, right? And all of us will. And that's what men need is reminders of who they are, and they need people that I've always felt like I've been the guy to go in the burning building while everybody's tying their shoes. And the crazy thing is, I used to have a dream all the time I couldn't get my damn shoes tied to get out on the field, right? Um I never really knew that about myself, that's just who I was, and but I was also the guy that goes into the burning building, and I I never wanted anybody's help, you know what I mean? And and then, and then that's just who I was, so it wasn't that big of a deal. And so I kind of see it. This was always who I was, and to have this bourbon and to talk about what it means, to crack open a bottle of bourbon and be a leader in the group and throw something on the table nobody's ever talked about, or be this kid that went and got a I say kid, a 10, you know, hadn't talked to this dad in 10 years, and to go grab a bottle of double-A bourbon, I think he got the six years and said, you know what, I'm gonna go crack this open with my dad. And so to be that man, and sometimes too, in the world we live in, to understand as young men that have fathers that are older than us, we have access to so much more information, understanding, acknowledging, and knowing. And we also have the benefit of seeing their mistakes that we chose not to learn from. But the humility really comes to understand and know how that manifested became in them, how that showed up in us. And am I gonna allow that anymore? Am I gonna honor my father? Am I gonna honor my father and all the men before me and draw a line in the sand? And that's what that four six is all about, no more, right? I'm gonna figure this out for me because if I can't serve everything around here to the level of of what I'm satisfied at, right? And that is the very thing when we talk about this is the biggest lie ever, right? In a boy's mind, and then even in a dad's mind. In a dad's mind, his son, there's no person on planet earth, your dad as well, thought this every day, that it whatever I have to do that can put that boy in a way to where he has a life better than me, that I can help him avoid the pain I had, right? And and and there's nothing he could ever do that he that I wouldn't love him. And you think about that on the flip side of that coin, and how often we as boys uh grow up trying to make sure we met that man's approval, and oftentimes we mistake it for their disappointment in themselves, their anger, or whatever, they can't get you to see it, right? And we take that on differently, right? That comes at us, and so when I see all these men and we're all that's that gap, that father wound. You're never, ever, ever, ever, your father will never tell you he's proud of you enough to make you believe it. It's the times when you know that you deserve that compliment, but you served yourself, not him.

Blind Spots And The Wake We Create

SPEAKER_03 36:37

I saw you on a pod, another podcast, by the way, that's brought us to this point. It went to a Bible verse, and it was it stuck with me because I thought it was powerful, and you both were talking about it. It was I was blind, now I see that in itself is profound because I feel like we're all blind to what's in front of us because we see challenge, or we have this tunnel vision. Is that kind of the root of all that?

SPEAKER_02 37:14

I gotta tell you, so when you talk about I see, all I see is what's in front of me. But do I see me in the act of doing? Um, and so the more I was able to see who I was, I became more aware of myself as I was in this version, versus the one I knew I was, that I know I am. That was when the work for me started going. And I'll tell you, this is what the humility that comes along with it. If you got a good heart and you're a good person, I promise you, you're gonna it it and a lot of times men with a good heart and and and and they're a good person, and we'll just suffer like hell. You know what I mean? We'll just suffer like hell and pretend like everything's okay until it's too late. Uh, and so we're want to be able to create that inviting opportunity and then also to be able to show men the pain that we've unintendedly caused our kids and everything around us, because sometimes with that tunnel vision, like you're talking about, we're in that speed boat and we're well, we got our eyes on the spot. And I tell you, what I learned through this was to build a rear view mirror and some side mirrors and everything else to see what exactly was I causing in my wake that I was not seeing because I was fixated, right, on a point, on something every time you got there, right? Every time you got there, it was never good enough. That's where sunset was always my place. Bourbon in the sunset, it was always like a hopeful destination. I'm gonna get there one day, I'm gonna get there one day, I'm gonna get there one day. And what I you know I realized during COVID, that's the thing when this brand came to be is bourbon in the sunset was always my jam. Man, if I was in Minneapolis and I could change my flight, get back to Austin, Texas, to get home and have a sunset of bourbon, the wind laid down, I didn't have to take a phone call, and I had my moment by myself. And what I realized after COVID, when that was, or during COVID, that was kind of an every night deal, if you remember, right? For a lot of people, I learned that I was beating myself up out there. And all these thoughts going through my head, which I realized were none of my thoughts. They were just the critics' voices that still lived in there that were drowning me out, they were driving me, but they kept me from being able to see. Hey, maybe, maybe you should listen up a little bit more inside. Maybe, maybe you'll find that courage to find what your inner knowing says you're supposed to be doing. And so, double A bourbon and a sunset uh is is a place uh for men to start having those conversations. But for me, I sat still, brother. And then I started to understand exactly what that was. This was my path. This was my path for me, uh, for God to wake me up and say, hey, guess what? All right, I got your attention yet. Maybe you ought to go do this. And I don't, I have no quit button. I have no quit button. You know, I just tell me I can't and I will. You know, where I'm at in life, I have such a profound sense of gratitude right now. I'm at peace. I can be right here with you, right? I don't need notes. I don't take notes anymore. You want to know why? Because what I got to say about this brand is my truth. I I don't need to go take notes from a lecture. This is my truth, and my whole thought process is if I tell my story, and then I give people the most people have we have such a gatekeeper, right, within us that we can't take criticism. Fine, watch me. I'll go first, I'll show you. I I, you know, I've whew, can't even begin. So there's just tears of gratitude for me now, man. I don't, I, you know, the and that that pain will leak out every now and then. There's still stuff in there that I still haven't let go of. But I had to, I certainly had to understand and know when Christ said, Father, forgive them for they know not what they do, that that that was an advance for me. And I didn't look at that the same way then. And now I look at that to know it's like when you finally wake up and understand you got grace, and that's the only way that you can get past it and move and go make you know peace with yourself. That's the hardest thing that we'll ever do as men, is really understand that the perfection we were chasing was in spite of the fear that was driving us. There's a lot of humility that comes with that, and that goes against everything we've ever been taught. But you know, who am I? What do I believe in? And am I honoring that? And uh there's a lot, there's plenty of humility that comes in with that, and there's really no one else on earth that needs to be the part of that conversation than yourself. And you can ever get into a growth mindset and say, you know what? I've tried it my way over and over and over and over, and I'm in that loop, and that loop, and that loop, and that's why I was taught to do it to find a center, put your hands down, say, you know what? I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 41:54

This is really I've told this story to a few people throughout my life. Um everything you just said, everything molds you, and and and and you know, you call talk about our light trauma in our life. I'm I'm open to all that. I I'm not afraid to admit it. I've been in therapy, and I'm in therapy right now. Yeah, not too frequently, but I think if the world had a everyone had a therapist, the world would be a better place. And the double A Legion, apparently. You need to be a part of that. When I was in high school, and this has stuck with me, and it has lit my fire to make sure I have a seat at the table. Moving forward, when I heard this, a counselor at my high school told me that I would never go to college, much less graduate from college, told me that I would what I was not going to do. And this is a year, maybe a year and a half, two years after I lost my father. And I'm thinking, you're gonna. So I was a little fragile at the time. And when I graduated, I mean, don't get me wrong, uh, there was some struggles, but don't to your point, don't ever tell me what I'm not going to do. Because that just maybe she was doing that on purpose to motivate me, because that's exactly what it did.

SPEAKER_02 43:22

Maybe that was always part of your path, and maybe you you look at that. Was that a gift or was that a burden? It's a gift to get to where you are, but you're still hanging on to that. Thank you very much. Thank the mirror. Thank you. Yeah, I what a great way to send a thank you note was sincere gratitude because, quite honestly, if you took that out of the equation, what would you blame your success on? That's a great question. That's one you gotta ask yourself, and then to really understand hey, maybe that that's exactly what I needed. I needed Somebody to challenge who I am, as opposed to this version of myself that's moping around as a victim.

SPEAKER_03 44:06

Alright, I got to figure out a way to get to there. I knew what I wanted to do for a career. But what I did in the meantime, all the way up till I got out of this business, and I'm going to admit this to you. You're the only person I've ever admitted this to. I've been married before. I've had a lot, quite a few amazing women come through my life who I never truly understood how to be a good partner. I thought I was. Because I pushed through to be so successful from that woman who told me that in 1988. My drive, yes, I will, I will survive. I will succeed. And I've I'm just now learning. I've forgotten that I didn't learn how to be a good partner.

SPEAKER_02 45:02

You know, I don't, I don't, I don't know that that's the right truth that you're gonna land at. Will you give me an opportunity to maybe reframe that for you?

SPEAKER_03 45:12

Please reframe.

SPEAKER_02 45:15

Um have you thought about the fact that, you know, with that voice in your head, that you're always seeking that approval for that person to come back and say, you know what? I've changed my mind now. I don't think that about you. And do you think in your relationships that you've had, how it started and who you were and who they were drawn to, Sean Clinch, the way I see you? And do you think there ever comes time that then you you then you feel like you gotta earn it, right? What if she already came to you and you were already enough, and then in your mind, how you saw yourself versus how she saw you? What if you still had that mentality that I gotta earn this, right? Because I don't deserve this. And what if, right? What if you were just good with you and then you're available and present for her storm, right? Because maybe she saw you as the one uh to come to there, there's a reason why people come together. I don't care what anybody says, there's a reason for everything in your path, and if you ever get there and to let and just to understand that and see it, you'll find peace. And then you'll find knowing and purpose, and and then in get in a group of men that call you on your bullshit, and also show you who you are because it's in here that drives us. That's why that's the arguments we're always settling as men. And you got to think of this too, Sean Clinch. You know, a guy like you, the way I see you, you have to think it's like, well, how many people did you come in their path and your light was so damn bright, and the only way they could dim it was to throw a stick in your spokes. And what lessons were those, you know? And so understanding oneself is such uh it's it's it's it's not easy work, but once you get on the path, you understand it, uh, and and then you can take it on as your own and do it yourself, and then have your group of community bend, right? Because there's everybody's been through, I mean, there's people that have been through all kinds of things where like, oh man, I want to talk to that guy, you know, or I want to talk to that guy because he sounds like my wife, right? I I've learned it's not, it's it's all you know, just behavior that's picked up. Where are some of our life experiences or some of the good gifts, the bad gifts, and maybe even the malevolent gifts that were given to us along the way that never defines who we were. You know what I mean? And so I uh wouldn't trade one experience in my rear view.

SPEAKER_03 47:54

All right, Aaron, I I know I pick this bottle up a lot, but it's I keep saying it's more than just a bourbon because it

The Brand Expands And The Mariners

SPEAKER_03 48:02

is. Um you're you're traveling across the country nonstop. You may be the busiest guy, not only in Liberty Hill, but you're out marketing this and telling the story, inspiring people. What's coming up on the agenda with the double A brand?

SPEAKER_02 48:19

Well, we're about to um, I guess I guess we launched the brand really like December of 24th. So what are we like 16 months into this deal? Um the great state of Louisiana has got some double A bourbon on the way. Um, so that'll be our ninth state that we've gone into in the last 16 months. And you know, we're in California, Florida, Texas, Missouri, Kansas, and I got to get up there and spend some time with those guys. And I will be doing that later this week. And then also up in Wisconsin and then the state of Washington that just came out of nowhere. One of the guys that's a part of this, and I don't want to go too much into detail, but man, the folks that have come here to be a part of this and and and how we had the opportunity to land double A bourbon with the Seattle Mariners. Um, and so we're in the middle of the explains the hat. Yeah, so so we're uh you know, we're I we're redlined back and forth on on, you know, we're already in the stadium and and going. And and if you're at the Mariner Stadium at um T Mobile Park, and if you're behind the behind the plate, you go down the left foul line and you go straight up as high as you can almost, there's the uh Trident deck, and that is being decoed right now as the AA Sunset Lounge. And so all three signature cocktails that Todd Wallingford from Longview that he created uh will be served there, and and we're gonna be throughout the stadium uh and and and the opportunity to really share that message of what it is for those folks at a game and at an organization that is so man, their culture is amazing. And and and to come together with them and to fly out there last August just to be in their golf tournament. And I just truly wanted to observe. I wanted to make sure what I thought was was certain. And man, with their president that's been there over 30 years, and and some of the folks that were, they're just great people. And that's really one thing with the double-A Legion is to really expose within a man is fearful leaders do not make good decisions for everyone else. We make them to solve for X, which is right in front of us. And if you're able to let those things go, you're able to see everyone's talents around you and just to be comfortable in the pace of what you're going. And man, the timing on this has been amazing. This is the 50th season for the Mariners. We're a part of that. Uh, we're just lucky to be a part of it. And the way they've embraced us has been incredible. And some of the things, maybe some cool ideas that are not ideas, some revelations that are going to come down the road on some podcasts and some other things that are going to be um centered around that. You know, hey, when we grew up, remember the Mariners plan, right? The Mariners and the Rangers, who was playing back then? Ken Griffith Jr. rolling around with that hat around backwards, dropping bombs, and Jay Buner and all these players, right? And uh to now see that those guys are involved in the organization like with respect, just true respect and giving back. And so that was the organization that happened to find its way to us, and the fact that we get to be a part of that and to have our own peace up there where we get to have a conversation with men, but also throughout the stadium. I'm I'm past the point, really, of of being shocked. I'm just I'm letting life flow and as it comes, and so I don't get surprised anymore. It's just more and more gratitude. That's that's truly all this is, and uh I just couldn't imagine. I there's no way I would ever go back to any point in my life and start over. Thank you very much for everything I've learned. Thank you very much to that lady for telling you you should write her a nice handwritten note and mean it and send it if she's still alive. I wish she was still alive and say thank you for motivating me.

SPEAKER_03 51:56

Yeah, resort in my life.

SPEAKER_02 51:59

It's that right, all always running from having to go in there and tell her, you know what, you were right. Yeah, never was. Never was.

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SPEAKER_00 52:08

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Why Failure Makes The Best Stories

SPEAKER_03 52:52

The Man Cave Story. We've been talking about some serious topics, but I want to give you time to show your personality, even though you have, but on a little more lighter sense. Is there any moment in your life that you can think of one story that's just as amusing now to tell it as it was when it happened? That's a man cave story. Worthy.

SPEAKER_02 53:17

So a story today that's just amusing today as it was then to tell. I'm gonna answer it this way because if I were gonna sit here and try to figure out like the most profound one, uh man, I'd probably end up regretting that because I'd think of something else. But I will say this it's usually the most painful times in life or the things that we screw up, or whatever, those are the things that we end up talking about, you know? And and so if you think of that through the lens of man, if I didn't fail, what the hell would I talk about? Yeah, what would my guys raise me about, right? Or what would I rise them about? Or uh it's just man, it's just the humility and all of it. There's nothing ever in life that you don't see everything around you. And you think about life, it's almost like a NASCAR. It's like you do this work, right? You come back out and you take it on the track and say, okay, how am I performing? You got to bring it back in and do some adjustments. That's what it is uh that we're doing, uh, you know, here obviously with the bourbon. But when you talk about, is there a story? Shit, man, I'm there's so many of them because it's who I am. And and most every one of them was a reminder to me uh that I was not uh learning of the lesson, right? That's usually what happens is when we refuse to learn the lesson, it keeps coming back around. We choose that option, and here comes failure. There's a reason for those. So that's it. That it, you know, you'd asked earlier, we talked about, you know, why'd you do this bourbon project?

Encouragement Without Needing Words

SPEAKER_02 54:51

A bourbon, the 4-6 affirmation accountability, that's the OG. It's where it all started. And so you asked me why I did this. You already know. Uh, because that night you guys all came to dinner and just element of surprise. I think there were seven or eight of you guys that are there. You had no idea that was gonna happen, but I did, and that's why I made this bourbon because I want to be able to tell my story in the Legion and everything that we do, but I also want to be able to show what that bourbon's for and just be able to look a man in the eye, and even those that don't have any words that they know how to say with no words necessary, say, hey man, you mattered, you made a difference in my life, and right, and I love you, and throw that into a man's veins of encouragement, right? That's what we all need. And sometimes we have to have a permission slip to go cut through the uncomfortable, and that's what that bottle's for. And I challenged one of the dads last night uh to take a bottle and to go walk into that uncomfortable. Only in discomfort does he find growth. That's one of the things I wrote down. Chase your fears, walk into him because that holds the answers that unlocks and releases pressure, and so start to look at life that way. Uh, that's why I made this bourbon to be able to go in and tell a man that you love him uh with no words necessary if you're not capable of it. And I have challenged myself. I have zero shame of saying anything to anybody about how I see them because I can see myself now and the humility that comes along with it, and every man wants to be seen. And let me tell you something, Sean Clinch. I see you, bro, and I'm proud of you. Yeah, keep going, keep going, step out, maybe go a different direction. Create with Sean Clinch because there's way too much. I ain't gonna quit in there. And sometimes it's just that voice of hey, if I just do this, it quickly gets swept away by that ego. This is not else is what's it?

SPEAKER_00 56:56

Amen. Tell me something good.

Tell Me Something Good

SPEAKER_03 57:03

Hey, Aaron Amsler has said a lot of good things, great things. How would you ideally like to close out this episode by telling me something good in a world in which there's too many negatives, or at least we perceive there to be.

SPEAKER_02 57:20

Wow, something good. There's plenty that's good with me now. Like I, you know, I'd say uh the opportunities uh that everyone has in front of them, and no, you know, we only we are our own worst critic, uh, but we are also the one that will hold us back, or we will be the one who will unlock and become what is best for us. So when I think about how my mind used to think and how it thinks now, I don't I I don't focus on the negative, right? If if I'm focused on the negative, it's caused a reaction. It's just showing the things still left in me that I gotta work on. And so I I look at it now, it's it's like, what can I do to make a difference? You know, what can I what can I do maybe to reach someone? But that's not who I've always been. You know, you and I have always been guys that saw pain, we saw conflict, we saw whatever, and we rushed right on in, didn't we? That's who we are, and we didn't see anybody when we were going to go defend others, but I bet you probably had a hard time defending yourself. And man, it's uh there's a reason for that because of the value that we place that we give to others. We got to give that value back to ourselves, that attention, that grace, that patience, that kindness, uh all the things that we can let go of that that built us, and we have that honest conversation and say, thank you for that experience. And and a lot of folks have a lot of experiences that are far worse than I ever had to experience. And it's the hero's journey, right? You can either see it for what it is, uh, you can be a victim in your own story, or you can write your own story.

SPEAKER_03 59:02

That's the truth. That's the truth, brother. Wow, learn a lot.

Where To Connect With Double A

SPEAKER_03 59:10

Introspective growth has always been my goal. And if you want to be a part of this, where go online, just tell people online where they can connect with you.

SPEAKER_02 59:24

Well, right now, the way they can connect with us, double A bourbon. So uh we have double A bourbon uh uh handles, uh pages, if you will. You know, I'm not the the social media guru. We've got a great guy of the Northeast that's doing that for us. And he and I are starting to have conversations, and every time we shoot a podcast, he and I will continue our conversation, uh as well as everything else that's going on. So double A bourbon, you can check out what the bourbon's about. We're kind of paired up with double A lesion right now, uh so tying them together, they will eventually break apart. And I've learned that everything happens right on time, and so if I try to I spend a lot of time forcing square pegs into round holes, and I just don't hey and had a lot of success with that, or did I? You know what I mean? And so to let life unfold with this lesion of where it's gonna go. Uh, I just know that I know my purpose on earth is to tell my story to help a man reflect and to see his own in it, and double A bourbon is all about a man getting a bottle of bourbon and going and telling his own story.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:19

That's it. Man, that's great. Man, I appreciate you, my brother. This has been extremely valuable. Um, I think it's a message everybody needs to hear, man or woman. But as men, I think we we overcomplicate things a lot and get in our way of a lot of things, and yeah, it's yeah, it's beautiful.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:41

I tell you, man, I you know, I had a calendar that was completely clogged up all the time, you know, travel and everything else. And I've learned that you know what, Sean Clinch, uh, on my calendar for April 22nd, 2026, was always this conversation I was gonna have with Sean Clinch.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:58

That's right, it was designated. We made it happen. We had to pivot a little bit, but we made it happen. Good people always find each other, brother. That's right, and never forget it. I'm proud of you. I'm proud of you, and you know what? Whenever you have an opportunity to discuss double A bourbon, the double A Legion, or whenever that topic comes up about that with Aaron Hamsler, you know what? It's always good to talk about it.